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Ask for it!

A rising tide lifts all boats,? or in this case a falling tide should have brought them all down. The SMUHSD and Sequoia School districts offer similar programs, pay similar salaries and benefits and most importantly receive their funding from the same source, San Mateo County.

If the two districts face similar financial constraints and cash flows then why isn't the Sequoia District also in financial trouble and laying off teachers and staff?

Superintendent Sam Johnson has offered to tender his resignation if the Board asks for it. Why would an innocent man offer to resign this position of leadership unless he held some degree of culpability?

The Sequoia High School District is hurting, but not failing. Why is the SMUHSD mired in a financial dilemma that may take years to heal?

The SMUHSD Board has been elected to serve and promote the public trust and provide a high quality of education. It is time that the Board ask for Sam Johnson's resignation and begin the healing process caused by this financial mess.

– Written by JC

Posted in

60 responses to “Ask for it!”

  1. Joanne

    While firing Johnson might be emotionally satisfying to some (who were not happy with many of the program changes Johnson made in the past few years) it would not solve the current budget crisis. In fact, an additional 5-10 teachers would have to be fired. (See discussion of severance pay under thread, A Teaching Moment). In addition, the same board who just renewed Johnson’s contract would be the same board who hires his replacement.
    So my vote is to not fire Johnson, work with him and the board to resolve the current crisis in the best possible manner with the least possible harm. After the budget issue is resolved this week, persons who don’t care for Johnson or the board’s leadership should determine how much longer their contract or terms are and then look for persons who might replace them in the future.

  2. Rich Grogan

    And after your dragon eats your second child, what will you do then?

  3. Joanne

    I think the tax rebates have stopped, Rich. It’s as simple as that. There is money coming in; there will be more next year than this year. This is a temporary crisis caused by 9-11 and commercial property tax rebates. The only thing that could cause this to be a recurring crisis is if the SMUHSD and the County don’t fix their communication problems. In fact, since it looks like the County gave bad advice, why isn’t anyone hounding them for the 3.5 million? They should pay for their bad advice. They have a HUGE budget and, unlike our volunteer SMUHSD board of trustees, the County Supervisors are paid “real” money — salaries of $150,000!! Aren’t they managing the County Assessor’s office?

  4. Joanne

    Don’t Basic Aid districts get their monies from the property taxes paid in their district? If so, comparing us to Sequoia is comparing apples to oranges…Sequoia probably did not have the large string of hotel tax rebates that the mid-Peninsula did. We’re still suffering from the downturn in the hotel business caused by 9-11.

  5. steve

    Actually it was Oracle and a few big corporations who hurt us the most as well as United. Joanne, today two board members spoke to the faculty at BHS and said what you just did. That the tax rebates have stopped. They said they believed that two years ago and at the end of last year and they were misled to believe this. I hope they don’t depend on information next year, just as I hope they wait for the info before they negotiate with the teachers

  6. Joanne

    Me too! (Hope that they wait for the correct income info before they negotiate with teachers) The “overpayment” last year was 2.7 million and the total deficit was 2.3; so if the employees of the SMUHSD had been paid correctly the SMUHSD would have ended 400,000 in the black. Deciding the raises AFTER the income has been determined is a no brainer change for this next contract.

  7. ASE

    Personally, I wouldn’t trust the “dragon” to make no brainer decisions. This only makes me wish more and more that I could vote. First I would attempt to recall the board, then, if successful, I would vote in board members whose decisions I could trust. Oh, and Joanne, would you mind citing your stats from here on out? In past posts your numbers and facts have been corrected and refuted, and I think it would not only spare confusion and the spread of false information, it might save you some embarrassment too.

  8. Joanne

    Elizabeth McManus (sp?), Finance Person for the SMUHSD.

  9. KRN

    Joanne,

    The math is fuzzy. Words like “overpayment” are part of Sam Johnson’s Scapegoat. The contract has a payment formula. The teachers are paid according to this formula. (% of new tax) The “overpayments” of one year are countered by “underpayments” in the next year to bring the balance to zero. The SMUHSD and its teachers are even. We have not been overpaid.

    At the bargaining table, the district is willing to accept a 0% raise for teachers. Why are they willing to accept this if teachers really owe them a 3% rollback? It doesn’t make sense.

    The budget numbers don’t make sense unless they are taken in the context of the contract.

    Also,
    Joanne you have been big on the number of teachers employed. These are the numbers according to the district.
    2001- 393; 02-404; 03-406; 04-417; 05-419; 06-407

    Why were there so many teachers emloyed in 04 and 05? If we are running a 7 period day with 407 teachers, then why did we have so many on the books in the past? It may help to explain the years of deficit spending. Sam was giving Hillsdale and extra $500,000 per year for the smaller learning communities.

    Is it overpayment of salaries or overspending by Sam.

  10. Joanne

    Sounds like the term “overpayment” is too emotionally laden. The contract, in prior years, had a formula for raises that was based on what the County Assessor PROJECTED the income was going to be for the SMUHSD. If the income came in lower, as it has for three of the last four years, then the SMUHSD wound up paying an amount which was higher than it could afford because it exceeded the income. Thus the salaries have been “financed” for several years by dipping into the reserves each year. ALL of its employees (including management) had their contracts negotiated on the PROJECTD income, rather than the ACTUAL income.
    I don’t think KRN’s statement that “overpayments” in one year are countered by “underpayments” is accurate.
    The last five years have produced deficits as follows: 02 (1.9); 03 about even; 04 (1.67); 05 (2.3) and 06 projection (2.3). The percentage difference between the County Assessor’s projected income and the actual income for the last five years is : 02 (3.47%); 03 (.16); 04 (3.76%) and 05 (3.47%) with this year’s being yet unknown. This is hard for many people to read (because they are not used to looking at numbers) but if you just look at 03, you will note that there was no deficit when the County Assesor’s income projections were accurate…there were big deficits when it wasn’t. So if the salaries of all the employees of the SMUHSD are based on PROJECTIONS, rather than ACTUAL, we will continue to have a mess. The teachers contract is currently being negotiated and this formula — of basing salaries on inaccurate projections from the County — as Steve posted above, HAS to stop.

  11. Joanne

    PS…Maybe KRN is saying that this year the teachers are offering to be “underpaid” to make up for last year’s “overpayment” — since the proposed increase is zero. The reserves have also been totally depleted so this is the only outcome that could occur.
    In the interest of full disclosure, a zero percent raise proposal, could still mean that a given teachers still get a 5% raise. Union contracts have a general raise (for everybody) as well as raises based upon the number of years in the job and raises based upon extra things like taking extra classes. So if a teacher had taken college classes (2.5%) and had served an extra couple of years in the district (2.5%) s/he might be receiving a 5% raise next year.

  12. Joanne

    PSS…One last “take away” about the way salaries are negotiated in this district. With the formula of looking at projected income, putting the pot on the table, and allowing all the different groups to dig in, there is a vested interest in never having any new programs and never having any new teachers. In a Basic Aid district, such as the SMUHSD, the amount per student goes up with every student we “chase away” from the district and for every teacher NOT hired or for every teacher fired, there is more for the exisiting ones. The public needs to fully understand this dynamic so that in the future we can make thoughtful decisions which balance the needs of the exisiting teachers with the needs of new or proposed programs that benefit students.

  13. Joanne

    One final thought for anyone out there who might be thinking “What idiots..why didn’t they correct the problem of paying raises on projected income the first time it resulted in a deficit?”
    The teacher’s union contract specified that this was the way raises would be determined. The contract was a three year contract and just ended in June of this year.
    Corporations, even large ones, can often turn on a dime when the ship is off course. Union environments are controlled by their contracts which are often multi-year contracts. The length of contracts if negotiable; but too short a term means there is constant turmoil among the workforce. Some of the turmoil that we are seeing among the teachers is no doubt caused by the uncertainty of what the next contract will bring — and it certainly is not a good economic environment to be negotiating for the teachers right now.

  14. Joanne

    I should have also mentioned that a multi-year contract isn’t just for the benefit of management. Unions like them too. The only time employees can decertify (i.e. vote to “get rid of”) their union is when they are inbetween contracts — such as now. Once the new contract is signed, then all teachers have to be a member of the union, whether the union adequately represents his/her interests or not.

  15. RCC

    If a teacher goes out on his or her own time and receives schooling to better he/she as a teacher that teacher should be getting a pay raise regardless of the budget. The budget crisis can’t stop our district from giving incentive for teachers to better their abilities to teach.

  16. Joanne

    RCC: There is a perfect world or a world as we’d like it to be, and then there is a real world, which is the one we live in. When you say that anyone — teacher or no teacher — should get a raide “regardless of the budget”, or regardless of income, where is that money going to come from? I talked to one woman after the meeting last night who said that her husband didn’t get a raise for 5 years because of his company’s financial situation. I also know of other folks who haven’t gotten a raise for the same number of years, because their entire raise was the increased cost of their health insurance. Believe me, I think there is nothing more valuable in the world than a good teacher — and our family has been blessed to have been taught by many. Everyone knows of a teacher who has been life-changing. But where is the money for these deserved raises going to come from if the income doesn’t come in from the county? So far, it’s come from the “savings” account. Now there’s no money left. So where is it going to come from?

  17. anon

    Joanne – Thank you for your detailed information. Also for the details in how our union contracts are negotiated. This is the stuff that rarely gets out, when headlines such as “3% CUT” are floated.

    Having said that, I think our teachers are incredibly valuable and should be paid more.

    I also agree, that removing Sam Johnson maybe emotionally satisfying to some, but in the end, our students are still stuck in this financial mess.

    Lastly,I invite all of us to attend board meetings, particularly when budgets are discussed – and remind our board members and optimistic administrators about optimistic spending programs.

  18. Marc Friedman

    Regarding anon last comment, “I invite all of us to attend board meetings, particularly when budgets are discussed “. Last night the Burlingame School Board (of which I am a member and currently President) met and the main items on the agenda were Year-End (2005-06) Assessment (Test Scores, etc.) Review, Review of the Findings and Conclusions of the Improving Student Learning Task Force, and Review of the Year-End 2005-06 Financial Results.

    With these three very important items on the agenda, there was all of two community members in the audience. They were both parent members of the Student Learning Task Force and participated in the discussion of that item but left prior to the discussion of the Year-End 2005-06 Financial Results. We discussed this item with no one in the audience.

    Like the agendas for all of our meetings, the agenda for this meeting was posted at all of our schools, on our web site and distributed to the press. I have been on the Board for five years and there have been meetings when we have had a large attendance (and had to move the meeting to a gym). This occurred when we were discussing potential budget reductions. Draw whatever conclusions you want.

    Oh, by the way, the Burlingame School District’s year-end balance (reserve) is at the top end of the “healthy” range per the policy created by our Budget Advisory Committee”. Also, our assessments (test scores) are up significantly over the past few years.

  19. KRN

    Joanne,

    I’m sorry but you don’t understand our contract, pay scale or work environement, and because of this you are passing on information that is misleading. The contract and formula was negotiated between the teachers and the district. It protects BOTH management and labor. Labor CANNOT ask for a salary increase that is larger than the formula. Comparing teachers to the private sector is misleading. As a teacher, I didn’t get stock options or 20% salary increases in the boom years either.

    Furthermore,
    Movement up the salary scale is not a raise. It is a step based upon predetermined criteria and an agreement in the contract. The steps do end and then there are no more salary increases except % changes that come from year to year revenue. The salary scale does not adjust with inflation it has to be negotiated.

    Finally,
    A corporation is owned by the share holders. The Board of Directors and the CEO have a fiduciary responsibility to the shareholders to make a profit and report and act upon alll irregularities. Corporations can change at a moments notice because if they don’t they will be sued by the owners, the shareholders.

    Schools are owned by the public, directed by a Superintendent with the oversight of a school board. The Board’s obligation is to protect the public and provide high quality eduction, it is not to turn a profit.
    These are two distinct operating environments and they required differt styles of leadership.

    Your analysis of the budget is incomplete without an understandiing of the contractual relationship between the district and its unions.
    The salaries and benefits of the teachers (and firefighter, police, etc) are a reflection of their value to the community. BHS gets 94% of its students into college and 64% into a 4-year college for one simple reason, we value education. Teachers are not being greedy, we are being asked to take less and provide the same level of service.

    The teachers salaries and benefts did not cause the crisis. The fact that the district employed too many teachers IS a factor in the budget crisis. The 7 period day, its pilot programm, and its continuation will continue to bankrupt the district. The revenues of the district HAVE increased each year.

    The SMUHSD is the ONLY district in the state right now having financial difficulty. Why?

    The district adopted the Academic Core and its adjuct, the 7 period day as its goal. It cannot pay for that goal and its is bankruptiing the district in the process.

    Stop blaming the teachers for this disaster. The teachers have not organized the students, exploited the students, or abused the students. The students have acted on their own accord.

  20. Rich Grogan

    KRN, teachers = union and union = teachers. The teachers vote to ratify the contract the union and district agree upon. They are in the mix and your denial that they are not will not make it so. During an election for a Board Member, the Union will endorse or will not endorse a canidate. Union = teachers and teachers = union.

    Occassionally, I would attend a District Meeting and I was amazed at the lack of people in the gallery.

  21. ann

    studen ts have acted, when they have, bases upon inaccurate info from teachers. why don’t you simply quit, krn?

  22. Joanne

    Marc, I am happy you surfaced because I have been thinking lately about wanting to publicly thank the Burlingame School District Board and administration for doing a fine job. I had my own private doubts in prior years that the BSD was being a little too conservative with the budget (and I’m usually quite conservative!) — I thought the reserve was too high and you should have given a little more to the teachers — but this latest fiasco has taught all of us, I think, the benefit of being cautious.
    You are absolutely right on about how no one watches where the tax dollars are going until there is a crisis. In this case, the faulty formula wound up financing the raises of ALL the employees of the SMUHSD (from the Superintendent to the custodians)by running down the reserves. The only people who didn’t benefit are Mr. and Mrs. Public and their children. We could all do a better job participating in elections etc. but people are also very busy and torn between too many activities. It is a challenge to stay informed even when one makes a sincere effort. I would like to see the BSD board as well as the SMUHSD board work to televise its meetings…and use more electronic e-mail blasts to communicate with the public. In fact, I wish the SMUHSD would put its full budget, as well as its analysis of this current on its website. Maybe the BSD could too. The televised City Council meetings work well for lots of folks to stay informed, while multitasking with homework, lunches or simply doing other stuff. It would be great if the school boards could do this too. Again, thank you, Marc, as well as any of your peers who might be reading this, for your service to the BSD. I know that several of you on the board have financial backgrounds and your willingness to serve in these volunteer positions with complicated budgets is more important now than it ever has been. When are you up for re-election? Want to move to the SMUHSD?

  23. Joanne

    Hey…I blah, blahed and didn’t actually say it. Thank you, Marc! And, Thank You to the rest of your board! Thank you also to the SMUHSD board…although, in hindsight, there is certainly stuff that could have been done differently, I appreciate your willingness to run and spend your time, month after month, at all those meetings.

  24. RCC

    Ann, I as a student act on the information I got from the board meeting last week, the information handed out there and the information on the district website, all of which are accurate sources.

  25. Kevin

    While I agree that budgeting based on a projected income is risky and leads to potential shortfalls, that is what the reserve for “econimic uncertainty” is for. I would even agree that it makes much more sense to budget based on the previous years actual revenue than the projected revenue. However, and here’s the rub, that would require revamping the entire budgeting process for public services. All public employees salaries and budgets are calculated based on projected revenue. The problem is just like how most people spend their family budgets: you base your starting number on what your employer/funder says you will get paid, then pay your overhead costs (mortgage, utilities etc), you examine the rest of your needs and determine how much you will allocate to each. If you do your budgeting well, you come out with all your needs covered and a little added to your savings each month. Unfortunately, a publicly funded organization has no recourse when our employer/funder effectively says, sorry I know I promised you X dollars this year, but I suffered a legal loss and I’m changing that number. If anyone has a suggestion as to how we can budget for the district based on how much money we know we have without skipping a year of payments, I’d love to hear it.

  26. Joanne

    To use your analogy, Kevin, it sounds to me like the public budgeting process has been more like a family planning their budget around proposed stock market increases and then being caught when the market took a downturn so they have to deplete their savings account.
    A private business in this situation would not give raises until income flow started turning around. If and when the profitability improved, it might give bonuses to its employees.
    I hope the teachers and administration can come up with some creative ways to fairly compensate employees without hurting the financial stability of the district.

  27. Joanne

    Kevin, perhaps the most practical way of giving a raise in a year that there is no money is to look at decreasing benefit costs or unbundling your benefits packages and let the teacher pick what is most important to them.
    For example, I understand that you all receive 15,000 for health insurance. That amount is probably reasonable for a teacher who is covering a spouse and several children, but for a teacher who is single or a teacher whose spouse has his/her own insurance that figure is way too high. So you could offer a choice: Would you like a raise and a lesser amount for health insurance, or would you like all your pot of money to go into health and none for raises? Or you could look for a cheaper health insurance provider and then have money available for raises. Or would you like to continue this plan but pay a monthly premium to help pay for it (like most private employees do) or pay a co-pay for a doctors visit?
    Someone posted here that teachers get an 8% contribution for their retirement plan. By private standards that is quite high (my former employer used to donate 4% only IF I also donated 4…and that was seen as a gold-standard plan). So if you could unbundle that you would have an opportunity for teacher choice as well….would you prefer to get 5% townards retirement and 3% raise?
    All these ways of dividing up the pie, seeing what is most important to the constituency etc. are things your union should be doing to best serve your needs and to get the package that means the most to each of you.

  28. Jeff

    The inherent problem I have with this discussion is that the solution to the district’s budget issue has been placed upon those who have done nothing to create the crisis- the teachers.

    You are incorrect to compare this organization with private industry. If my CEO chose to enact programs and hire employees despite the known risk of future income he (and the Board of Directors) would be held accountable for their actions. Institutional investors (i.e. CALPERS), and stockholders would immediately call for his resignation and at the next shareholder meeting the board members themselves would be proxied out of their jobs.

    I would love to hear an analyst call where the CEO blamed his gross negligence in forecasting on the hard working employees of his company. Street analysts would be lauging out loud.

    So let’s hold off on the comparisons with corporate america. Based on the timelime of events on the front page of the Burlinage newspaper it’s clear that this group repeatedly ingored the warning signs of the budget crisis and continued to act in a fiscally irresponsible maner.

    When the 2007/2009 terms expire for the current leadership I believe we need to replace them with a team that can 1) make strategic long term plans while staying within operating margins and 2) take responsibility for their actions.

  29. Joanne

    Jeff, I think Kevin’s question was how does one continue to fund raises and benefits in an uncertain economic climate. Since what was done before hasn’t work, it does make sense to look at what others have successfully done. One thing is for certain: If the SMUHSD does things the same as before, we shouldn’t expect a different result.

  30. KRN

    Jeff,

    Your analysis should be on a board.

    Joanne,

    Please read Jeff’s post. It should answer ALL of your questions. Also,
    your employer “donated” almost 8% to Social Security and so did you. The 4% match that you are refering to is your 401(K). Teachers do not get matching funds into a retirment fund outside of our retirement program.

    Also, the $15,000 Health is a maximum. Not every teacher gets that amount. Once you start to “unbundle” health care choices, each choice gets more expensive. The health insurance providers punish buyers with higher prices if they offer a cafeteria program. The district keeps packages bundled to keep costs down and keep more people insured.

  31. Anonymous

    I’d like to note the passing of Wesley Collier, Sr., at age 76, a math/science teacher from my era at San Mateo High School. He remained active in that department until 1993.

  32. Rich Grogan

    “A rising tide lifts all boats,? unless it is riddled with holes and filled with deadwood.

    What do you call doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome …….. insanity!

  33. Joanne

    That’s interesting, KRN. I never knew that teachers are not included in the social security system…if you get a similar pension plan at an 8% contribution from the SMUHSD you ought to be advising the federal government on how it could fix Social Security!!
    Anyway, my comments addressed to Kevin were not designed to place a value-judgement on whether your 8% contribution is good or bad, or whether your 15,000 health insurance is good or bad, but rather that your salary and benefits should be viewed as a whole when you negotiate and that you should make sure that you are negotiating for the most meaningful items for you (since every dollar taken from one pot is a dollar that can’t be spent someplace else).
    I never meant to compare teacher compensation with the private sector; it’s apples and oranges. Teacher compensation is much more benefit-oriented (lots of paid time off, health insurance, pension-based retirement) vs base salary (not as much). Also the salary in a teacher environment is longevity based rather than performance based. Private pay is usually the complete opposite — higher base pay, with very little vacation, no pension plan and weaker health insurance. It’s up to you and the rest of the teachers to decide what’s most important for you in your negotiations.

  34. KRN

    Teachers do negotiate our benefits and salary as a package. One dollar towards benefits a one less dollar in salary (an one less towards retirement!)

    Also, teachers do not get paid vacations. We have a limited work year. We only get paid for the days we work. The idea having a Summers of is very funny. I like many other teachers have to work in the summer to make ends meet. We do not get paid in the summer NOR is there an opportunity for us to make our market wages for our trade. In other works, I can only earn my wage when school is in session.

    The private market forces the individual to take more risks with health, vacation, and retirment, but also offers more opportunities for pay, bonus, stock, etc. The contributions and matching funds of most 401(k)s are big incentives in the private market. Our 403(b)’s are comparative, but there are never any match funds and most teachers don’t make enough money to put significant contributions into these tax deffered accounts.

    These are two distinct choices. It seems that people don’t understand that if you destroy the compensation and benefit structure of the school system, you will fail to attract and retain anyone of value. I hold a B.S. teaching credential, MA and education units equal to an additional masters degree.

    Its actually up to you and the public to decide if you want a great set of teachers, or a lower cost set of replacements? Can you afford private school?

  35. guest teacher

    Joanne,
    Your latest comment is the exclamation point on the argument that you need to stop writing. You are too underinformed to make a valid opinion. How did you not know we don’t pay into SS? How did you not know we didn’t vote for the core or the 7th period day? Let people like Jeff and KRN comment so that the public can be properly informed. Your ignorance is making me crazy. Seriously, stop.

  36. Joanne

    I’m flabbergasted that you are so defensive. At BHS the teachers did vote for the 7 period day. What I wasn’t aware of, is that this vote was for the pilot and that the full implementation was not something you got to vote for. So I didn’t know that? So what? KRN got to tell me. There is no reason to be so hostile. Whether or not you pay into social security is neither here nor there, is it? On the one hand, you save the 7.5 percent or so that everyone else contributes (for perhap nothing in the future). AOn the other hand, if the Social Security system does not go bankrupt, then you don’t get the same benefits as everyone else. I’m sorry I drive you crazy. Someone, I believe it was one of your students, wanted to know what a “personal attack” was. This is it. Let’s debate issues and not personally attack one another, okay?

  37. KRN

    Teachers pay 8% and the district contributes 8% to the STRS retirement. The big problem here is that teachers cannot collect from both Social Security and STRS. T/F, someone who moves from the private sector into teaching will not be able to collect a full benefit from Soc Security. Also, teacher is not allowed to collect Soc Sec benefits from a non-teaching spouse after death.

    The salary, benefit, and retirement world of teachers is different than the private sector, that is one reason why our contracts, based on taxes for salaries, are different.

    On the other hand, the fiscal responsibility (or lack there of) for proper budgeting follows the same standards. Once exception, in the private world, Sam Johnson would be fired or indicted for financial mismanagement.

  38. teacher

    Today, we lost our “temporary”(2nd year) teacher. He will be replaced by our librarian -who has never seen the inside of a classroom. I ask you how does this value our students education?

  39. Rich Grogan

    Isn’t true that teachers have the option to take their pay in accordance with the teaching year or to spread it out over the full year?

    Also, for those teachers, who work during the summer, most of those jobs contribute to SS, hence they do not loose out on SS. Police and Fire Departments that are in PERS do not qualify for SS, so to qualify for SS Police and Fire have to work a second job, also.

    What part of a teacher’s salary goes towards the Union Dues?

  40. KRN

    Rich,

    Sorry, you are 100% wrong on this one. Teachers vested in STRS will not collect from Social Security. I am fully vested in Social Security yet I will never be able to collect b/c I became a teacher and will draw from STRS. So, if I do work in non-teaching jobs, I have to contribute 8% of my salary (as does my employer) into a the SS program that I cannot draw from. PERS retirement DOES allow a draw from SS, but not STRS. It is a very special federal law that prohibits STRS teachers from getting STRS.

    Spreading your salary out over 12 months and earning for twelve months is two different things. We are only paid for 10 months of work, not 12.

    Union dues… $90 per month.

  41. ASE

    Joanne, I’m glad that someone finally was able to say what most of us have been thinking about you for so long. I’m only sorry it wasn’t me. Good job guest teacher. It’s ok to be misinformed, nobody said otherwise. The problem with you, however, is that you are so sure of your wrong information and that you refuse to CITE YOUR SOURCES. As I said before, double checking your information will save us a lot of frustration and you a lot of embarrassment. And I was the student who mentioned personal attacks. Don’t insult me by thinking that I didn’t know what one was. I’m 17 years old and I pride myself in knowing simple things such as these. Maybe you make these assumptions based on your child. If your high school child doesn’t know of such facts, then maybe you should rethink your support of the board, becuause they have seriously reduced a department which your child could use. Anyways, I do not deem my comments or guest teacher’s comments as personal attacks; we’re just frustrated because you have not been understanding the point that we’ve been trying to get across.

    You don’t know what you’re talking about half the time, so maybe you should listen instead of talk. “Seriously, stop.”

  42. Joanne

    ASE, Steve asked me where I got the figure that the SMUHSD is operating with 12 less teachers this year than last. I told him: A quote from Avelar in the paper. KRN also cited the same number later.
    Someone else asked me where I got another number the other night, and I told them Elizabeth McManus’ financial presentation. I’m happy to “cite my sources” and I have done so. I didn’t about the teacher’s social security issue and I found it interesting to read and learn something new. I never made any representations about social security; the topic came up when KRN responded to something I said about unbundling benefits and rethinking the importance of them if the teacher’s salary dollars are going to benefits that they don’t find particularly meaningful. Perhaps somebody finds your comments helpful, but I’d find them more helpful if you added something to the conversation, rather than simply attack characters.

  43. ASE

    If you insist on me “adding something to the conversation” I’d like to ask the bloggers in cyber space, about the process regarding the recall of local elected officials. If you support Griffen, Hanley, and Cohn-Lyle, that means that I absolutely do not. They will be serving their last year on the SMUHSD board if I have anything to say about it.

  44. Joanne

    I think KRN already posted something about recall information.

  45. ASE

    Are you sure? Maybe you should double check before you say anything.

  46. Joanne

    KRN, how long does it take for a teacher to vest in the STRS and what percentage of last pay is the pension benefit?

  47. Anonymous

    Vesting takes 5 years. Pension benefit is based upon a combination of years of contribution, age, and final salary.

    If Sam Johnson is making $190,000 per year, he will retire with a FAT check.

    You can get the data at http://www.calstrs.com/

  48. fred

    ASE, in experience there is wisdom, you should pay your elders some respect and listen to all points of view in order to draw your own conclusions.

    Trying to silence opposing points of view is not a good way to learn or educate.

    This site is about open communication, while I don’t mind getting into the muck in order to voice my opinion, I have always believed every opinion has merit. I have agreed and disagreed with Joanne and many others, but not once did I tell anyone their viewpoints are not worthy and they should not express their thoughts. If you disagree with an opinion or statistic, just counter with your own facts and beliefs.

    It is amazing that a debate over education and learning would draw such a negative reaction. If you think you can teach Joanne something, teach her but please don’t tell her not to express her opinion, I am interested in hearing her thoughts as well as yours.

    Open communication is what this forum is all about.

  49. ASE

    Thank you Fred for you input. I’m not sure how long you have been reading up on the interactions between Joanne and I but she has been less than open to my opinions too. I tried to be honest by identifying myself as a student, but no matter what happens it comes back to bite me. I feel like no one takes me seriously, except the other students, and some of the teachers. Even those who support me such as Rich give me “an A+ in grown up Civics 101” as if I’m just an on looker, or that I derserve a grade for what I’m doing. If this is the way things are going to be, I’ll use a new name in order to gain new respect and shed this curse of being seen as a student.

  50. imastudent2

    ASE, you are a student, so what’s wrong with being seen as a student?

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